Usage Meter

[Ratty]

Hi

Been with Talk Talk just under and month and with a couple of small glitches everything seems good.

The main thing I see as being missing is a usage meter as I have two teenage sons who enjoy on line games.

I searched high and low but cannot find any software that would do this.

So come on Talk Talk it would allow me to stop nagging them if its OK or unplug them if not.

Cheers

JOhn

[HRAY]

Hi Ratty
Usage meter has been raised before with a basic 'no' (at moment) and I am unaware or seen any alternative software programs put forth. See other previous topics on capping etc
TT compared with some other providers are 'more generous'.
Only advise I can give you is 'if in doubt' lol

[trinity]

Hi

Been with Talk Talk just under and month and with a couple of small glitches everything seems good.

The main thing I see as being missing is a usage meter as I have two teenage sons who enjoy on line games.

I searched high and low but cannot find any software that would do this.

So come on Talk Talk it would allow me to stop nagging them if its OK or unplug them if not.

Cheers

JOhn

Have a look at bandwidth monitor lite from this free download site: http://www.snapfiles.com/Freeware/network/fwnetmoni.html

[Ratty]

THanks for the quick reply - I'll try bandwidth monitor. Looks like I'll have to install on each machine that uses the internet but wont help with Wii etc.

Come on Talk Talk provide a meter!

Cheers

John

[Squawk]

Ratty, google for something like "snmp router monitor", and find software like this (http://www.byteometer.com/snmp-router-monitor.asp)
SNMP is a protocol that allows monitoring of various aspects of your router, in particular the ammount of traffic coming and going at any given time, total downloads over periods of time, that kind of thing. I have no experience with that piece of software I linked to, but it should give you an idea of what is available. Only need to install it on one pc too.

[Ratty]

Thanks Squawk

I've given up for tonight. Managed to find out how to enable snmp and but cannot detect my router. May try again tomorrow I have a Netgear DG834G V3.

Cheers

JOhn

[Squawk]

Ratty, without knowing exactly what you are doing, if using snmp, try public@ipaddress, replacing ip address with the LAN ip of your router, so something like public@192.168.1.1

[Ratty]

Hi

I'm trying to set up PRTG on a Netgear DG834G V3. I've enabled snmp on the router via a hidden menu.

I've added snmp to inbound services but I still cannot get it to connect.

Cheers

John

[Squawk]

Ratty, I might have a look at it later. I dual boot my machine linux and windows, 90% of the time its linux so I can't test out that software right now. Next time I am in windows I will have a play with that software and see what I can figure out.

Can you post a screenshot of the configuration of prtg (the bit where you tell it where the router lives), maybe I can figure it out from there. Hide your ip or pm me it if you dont want any of the config on show.

[Ratty]

Hi
Thanks for the quick reply I'll have to come back to this later as I've got to take the kids out! These things always take a long time.

I found this on a Netgear forum:-
SNMP does work on this router. For some strange reason however, the router adds a firewall rule to disable SNMP traffic as soon as you enable SNMP!

Steps:

1) Access your router on http://192.168.0.1/snmp.htm
2) Enable SNMP and make your community name 'public'. Click Apply.
3) Type in the address bar: http://192.168.0.1/setup.cgi?todo=debug (it will say "Debug enabled").
4) Click Start, Run, type in 'cmd' to get a command prompt.
5) Type 'telnet 192.168.0.1' (You will see a BusyBox shell prompt).
6) type 'iptables -D INPUT 1' at the # prompt (this removes the SNMP blocking firewall rule).

If you changed your router's IP away from 192.168.0.1 then change it to whatever IP your router uses.

And now PRTG and whatever else can access SNMP. Note: in PRTG the WAN traffic is logged as LAN traffic, and the IN/OUT counters are reversed. LAN traffic is not logged.

I've tried it but no luck.

Cheers

John

[Squawk]

the netgear router uses iptables? omg never knew. Ok firewall config becomes easy, I have plenty of expience with iptables.

Before you go about changing firewall rules, it might be a good idea to learn what those rules actually are

The command "iptables -D INPUT 1" deletes the first rule in the input chain. Fantastic if that rule does happen to be the rule you want to delete, not so great if its not.

You might not really wanna post the output from this as it will reveal your firewall config, however it should not reveal your ip address so is probably safe (plus iptables is awesome anyway)

Run the command
iptables -v -L INPUT -n

the -v tells it to be verbose (tells us which interface a rule applies to, internet or lan for exmaple), -L tells it to list the rules, INPUT tells it to list the INPUT chain, and -n means dont do reverse dns lookup, just print ip addresses

Here is the output I get from running that command on my linux machine

Chain INPUT (policy DROP 6028 packets, 559K bytes)
pkts bytes target prot opt in out source destination
2148 251K ACCEPT all -- lo * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0
62155 40M ACCEPT all -- eth0 * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0 state RELATED,ESTABLISHED
0 0 ACCEPT tcp -- eth0 * 192.168.1.3 0.0.0.0/0 tcp dpt:22
0 0 ACCEPT tcp -- eth0 * 192.168.1.3 0.0.0.0/0 tcp dpt:139
0 0 ACCEPT tcp -- eth0 * 192.168.1.3 0.0.0.0/0 tcp dpt:445
0 0 ACCEPT tcp -- eth0 * 192.168.1.0/24 0.0.0.0/0 tcp dpt:21

Now that probably looks like gobbledygook to you, but its fairly simple. To explain, lets look at the line that ends in "tcp dpt:22" I will refer to ssh thoughout this as port 22 is actualy the port on which ssh connections are established

The first two fields, in this case 0 0, tell us how much data has used this rule. As you can see it is currently none since the machine was rebooted, as I havnt used ssh since the last reboot.

The third field "ACCEPT", tells you that if this rule is matched by a packet, I want to accept the packet.

tcp tells us its a tcp type packet, eth0 is the name of the interface (my network card in this case) on which the packets will be received. The next column is important. In the source column you can see 192.168.1.3. This tells the firewall to only accept SSH connections from that ip address. Anything else will pass over it and be ignored. 192.168.1.3 is another machine on my LAN, called marge.

The distination "0.0.0.0" actually means match all ip's, but since its an incoming connection the only place it can be going is my machine. I could easily have set that to my own ip, but it would make no real difference to the rule.

And finally tcp dpt:22, which tells the firewall which type of connections I want to allow, which is connections to port 22. Port 22 is actually the ssh port, as I said at the start

Now, if possible could you post the output of that command here and I can take a look at it for you. Certainly we can see which rule is getting in the way of SNMP and can remove it accordingly. It seems odd to me that a given service should be dropped by one rule, a much more robust firewall is one that drops all connections by default and only allows the ones that you specifically ACCEPT. If you look at the first line of the bit I posted, you can see it says (policy DROP), indicating that all connections not matched by one of those rules will be dropped.

If someone else can confirm for me that you have full access to iptables using the netgear router I will be ordering one tomorrow. Does it also support ssh?

[Ratty]

Hi

I tried that command and it said not recognised. However PRTG does now seem to be working although I presume this machine has to be on to monitor usage.

Although the other PC that is on is coming up as wireless?? and its hardwired.

Clearly I've got a lot to look into (everyone getting fed up with me at present). Shame TAlk Talk cannot provide one as other ISP's do.

Many Thanks for your help!

John

[Squawk]

Without knowing for certain, I would say that computer doesnt have to be on. the statistics will still be saved in a log somewhere in the router. I might be wrong, but I think thats how it should work.

Regarding that command, did you telnet in as before? I had a good look at the netgear forums (just registered actually, got a couple of questions for them) and there is no reason for that command not to work. can you possibly paste the output you get when it doesnt work? Does it say "command not found", or "unrecognised option". Obviously iptables can be run, since you did it once to delete that rule.

[Ratty]

Yes - forgot the first bit - I'll try later as I'm rushing & more haste less speed etc.

when I did run it correctly I think I got lots of DOS & 0.0.0.0's when I ran it.

Cheers

John

[Squawk]

ratty, you got me digging now. I have posted on the netgear forums to find out exactly what we can and can't do using iptables to allow access everytime you reboot the router, and to see what else might be available, and presumably they will tell me what needs to be done if any further steps are required.

if you want to keep track of that particular thread then have a look here (http://forum1.netgear.com/showthread.php?t=21618)
Sorry matt and chris if I shouldnt link to other forums like that.

Anyways, depending on the answers I get I might be getting one of those routers, and if I do go for one, watch out matt and chris there will be another squawk security script alert as I try to tie the thing down to behave properly ;)

[OCE_Stephen]

Hi guys,

Check out this POST (http://www.talktalkmembers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=427), I have been testing it for a little while and its a good little tool.

Stephen

[Ratty]

Hi Stephen

Does it work for a router with 4 PC's and possibly wireless connections?

Cheers

John

[OCE_Stephen]

Hi,

It monitors a specific network adapter including wireless however it sits on each PC so you would need to run and monitor on each PC.

You can set an alarm limit at which it will give you a pop-up warning so if you had 4 PC`s you could maybe set-up each one with a 10Gb limit.... Just an idea.


Stephen

[Squawk]

Looks like a nice bit of software, but the necessity of running it on each pc is why I was suggesting finding an snmp application of some kind.

[trinity]

Hi,

It monitors a specific network adapter including wireless however it sits on each PC so you would need to run and monitor on each PC.

You can set an alarm limit at which it will give you a pop-up warning so if you had 4 PC`s you could maybe set-up each one with a 10Gb limit.... Just an idea.


Stephen
I suppose it would be useful to know when our 'usage month' starts and ends?

[Dustybug]

I suppose it would be useful to know when our 'usage month' starts and ends?

Good point! :cool:

[pjnsmb]

Yes it's been puzzling me too ?

[Ratty]

Hi

I notice the Netgear forum has not produced much response. At present I'm sticking with Bandwidth Monitor 2 Lite by Rokario on each machine.

The ideal would be for Talk Talk to provide a usage meter.

THe snmp looks like it could be a better solution but I need to spend a lot of time sorting it out.

Squawk, thanks for your help this site looks interesting:-

http://walliteam.com/dg834/

Cheers

John

[matt]

Just posted elsewhere, spoke with CPW Networks and they are aware of the need for this and actually have something in the works. Not sure of delivery dates but its going to be months rather than weeks.

[pjnsmb]

Matt or Stephen

when you get chance :

I suppose it would be useful to know when our 'usage month' starts and ends?

Yes it's been puzzling me too ?


cheers

pete

[matt]

To the best of my knowledge its a calendar month.

Just spoke to the guy that manages these for TalkTalk and he has confirmed that it is indeed a calendar month for everyone.

This means you get more download in Feb :)

[damianiw]

Just posted elsewhere, spoke with CPW Networks and they are aware of the need for this and actually have something in the works. Not sure of delivery dates but its going to be months rather than weeks.

That's good news as I have 2 Nintendo DS' in the house now and an xbox - none of which can run a bandwidth monitor!

[Bang]

MAAF/BT had a log of my usage in 'my account' when I went into it on the web. IT was very handy but then my usage allowed was half! :)

I hope once my problem is sorted and profile checked I get more speed and can download and surf better to take advantage of it! :D

[matt]

FYI a lot of routers have ATM/WAN counters on one of their status pages which show the amount of traffic the router has shifted. Combine that with the system uptime and you can get a good idea.

I have a little program that queries an Echolife HG520s and shows uptime, download, upload and total.

Reset the router each month and that will give you your counter :)
Turn it off however and the counter is lost :(

[Squawk]

matt, im intrigued. This a script that I can see the code of or an actual application?

If its a script, linky?

[Ratty]

40

Can you get usage from packets?

I can get the folowing stats from the Netgear

Cheers

John

[Squawk]

##edit sorry mised the / (as you see from my post, I made the assumption it was a '). See matts post below

Ratty, you can ignore the packets, that information already tells you how much was sent

RX B's are the number of received Bytes, and Tx B's are the number of transmitted bytes.

WAN = The internet
LAN = Your network (ethernet)
WLAN = Your wireless network

So, your total downloads and uploads (since the router was last rebooted, is simple Rx + Tx on the WAN interface (I think).

Might be worth checking that talktalk do add them together to determine usage.

[Ratty]

Right so the LAN has high TX as its sending from router to connected PC's?

The figures seem too small 10 k bytes ?? I'm sure I am being thick here.

This does look promising though as it should see all traffic including the Wii & DS.

Cheers

John

[Chris]

The B/s means Bytes per second; these are average transfer rates. Low figures are due to mainly idle-time during the 28-40 hours monitored.

[Ratty]

Right thanks Chris - Not so helpful then...............Oh well back to looking into snmp then.

Cheers

John

[Ratty]

Well the Netgear forum suggested another router:-
-----------------------------------------------------------------Yes, an example of that router which does this monitoring will do that job for you, irrespective of the number of devices connected. That example is DGFV338. DG834G is "low-end" and does not have that feature.
----------------------------------------------------------------
From the manual of DGFV338:-
Table 2-2. Traffic Meter Parameters
Parameter Description
Enable Traffic Meter Check this if you wish to record the volume of Internet traffic passing
through the Router's WAN1 or WAN2 port.WAN1 or WAN2 can be selected
through the drop down menu, the entire configuration is specific to each
wan interface.
• No Limit - If this is selected specified restriction will not be applied when
traffic limit is reached.
• Download only - If this is selected the specified restriction will be applied
to the incoming traffic only
• Both Directions - If this is selected the specified restriction will be applied
to both incoming and outgoing traffic only
Enable Monthly Limit Use this if your ISP charges for additional traffic. If enabled, enter the
monthly volume limit and select the desired behavior when the limit is
reached.
Note: Both incoming and outgoing traffic are included in the limit.
Increase this month's limit Use this to temporarily increase the Traffic Limit if you have reached the
monthly limit, but need to continue accessing the Internet. Check the
checkbox and enter the desired increase. (The checkbox will automatically
be cleared when saved so the increase is only applied once.)
This month's limit This displays the limit for the current month.
Restart traffic counter This determines when the traffic counter restarts. Choose the desired time
and day of the month.
Restart Counter Now Click this button to restart the Traffic Counter immediately.
Send E-mail Report before
restarting counter
If checked, an E-mail report will be sent immediately before restarting the
counter. You must configure the E-mail screen in order for this function to
work (see “Event Logs and Alerts” on page 4-32).
When limit is reached Select the desired option:
• Block all traffic - all access to and from the Internet will be blocked.
• Block all traffic except E-mail - Only E-mail traffic will be allowed. All other
traffic will be blocked.
• If using this option, you may also select the Send E-mail alert option. You
must configure the E-mail screen in order for this function to work.
Internet Traffic Statistics This displays statistics on Internet Traffic via the WAN port. If you have not
enabled the Traffic Meter, these statistics are not available.
Traffic by Protocol Click this button if you want to know more details of the Internet Traffic. The
volume of traffic for each protocol will be displayed in a sub-window.Traffic
counters are updated in MBytes scale, counter starts only when traffic passed is at least 1MB.
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Sadly around £130 anyone know of any other suitable modems?

[blackeagle]

@ Squawk

I can pull iptables off my linksys router. I monitor my line stats using a tool called DMT, but it has a handy cli for talking to the router with.

Its based around busybox and I was wondering if there is a linux command that will give me upload/download stats as the http interface is, quite frankly, pants.

[Squawk]

blackeagle, yeah iptables will do that easily enough. Now I havnt been near a linksys router so I don't know exactly what is available, or what you client can do, but here is a quick summary.

Run the following to see output from your system
Raptor ~ # iptables -vnL
Chain INPUT (policy DROP 28 packets, 784 bytes)
pkts bytes target prot opt in out source destination
78 7826 ACCEPT all -- lo * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0
1851 1281K DROPS all -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0

1713 1269K ACCEPT all -- eth0 * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0 state RELATED,ESTABLISHED
0 0 ACCEPT tcp -- eth0 * 192.168.1.3 0.0.0.0/0 tcp dpt:22
0 0 ACCEPT tcp -- eth0 * 192.168.1.0/24 0.0.0.0/0 tcp dpt:21
0 0 ACCEPT tcp -- eth0 * 192.168.1.0/24 0.0.0.0/0 tcp dpt:873
28 784 LOGS all -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0

Chain FORWARD (policy DROP 0 packets, 0 bytes)
pkts bytes target prot opt in out source destination

Chain OUTPUT (policy DROP 0 packets, 0 bytes)
pkts bytes target prot opt in out source destination
78 7826 ACCEPT all -- * lo 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0
1821 222K ACCEPT all -- * eth0 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0 state NEW,RELATED,ESTABLISHED

Chain DROPS (1 references)
pkts bytes target prot opt in out source destination
32 3542 DROP udp -- * * 192.168.1.3 0.0.0.0/0 udp dpts:137:138

Chain LOGS (1 references)
pkts bytes target prot opt in out source destination
0 0 LOG tcp -- eth0 * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0 LOG flags 0 level 4 prefix `IN_TCP_LOG '
0 0 LOG udp -- eth0 * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0 LOG flags 0 level 4 prefix `IN_UDP_LOG '
0 0 LOG icmp -- eth0 * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0 LOG flags 0 level 4 prefix `IN_ICMP_LOG '

Thats what I got when I ran that command just now. If you look at the left two columns, you can see that we have two counters, for "packets and bytes", that do exactly what you would thing. Ie, the count the number of packets, and the total number of bytes of data that were matched by that given rule. Now, the hard way to go about things would be to add up all the counters from the various rules in all the different tables to up with a total. If you can't add rules then you may be stuck with this option.

A better way though is to create a rule with the sole purpose of counting the number of packets that transit through your machine. Now, you need to check exactly what structure your iptables ruleset has at this point, to make sure you insert the chain at the right point. On a desktop running iptables my first rule is to allow all connections on the local interface, ie, all connections from my machine to my machine. These packets never leave my machine, so I don't want them included in the bandwidth log. In my case then, this rule is inserted at position 2.


iptables -N BANDWIDTH #create a chain called BANDWIDTH
iptables -F BANDWIDTH #Flush the chain to make sure its empty
iptables -I INPUT 2 -j BANDWIDTH
iptables -I OUTPUT 2 -j BANDWIDTH
iptables -I FORWARD -j BANDWIDTH #first rule in chain on the forward chain.


Now every packet entering or leaving your router that passes through the filter table will be logged. To get the total bandwidth you will have to add up the inbound and outbound traffic yourself, but that should be simple enough.

There are two other tables to look at, namely the nat table and the mangle table.

To look at either of those tables run
iptables -t nat -vnL
or
iptables -t mangle -vnL

I won't cover these here as I have no clue how your router makes use of or handles them, but from this post I hope you should be able to work the rest out.


So far these rules have been very general, but you can make them far more informative. Within the Bandwidth chain you could start to define rules such as the following to determine all kinds of usage statistics


iptables -A BANDWIDTH -d 192.168.1.10 #Count traffic heading to 192.168.1.10
iptables -A BANDWIDTH -p tcp --dport ssh -s 192.168.1.2 # Count all ssh traffic originating from 192.168.1.2


The lists of things you can are endless. Don't go completely nuts, millions of rules will mean that every packet has be be inspected that many more times, not really a problem but it may eventualy cause a slowdown (**** of a lot of rules though to cause that).

If I missed anything or made it sound complicated, gimme a prod

[damianiw]

Does it look like there's any solution for the DG834G, I had a quick play and did get SNMP working but I don't want to leave a pc on to monitor it all the time - if this had to be the case I may as well setup the pc as a router.

I appreciate all the help here, it's really poor that this router doesn't have these sorts of stats on it's web interface, but I guess you get what you pay for.

As the netgear uses iptables and busybox would your script work squawk ?

[Squawk]

damian, I havnt had a play with a netgear router either. I actually posted recently on the netgear forums to see what you can do with iptables and didnt get much of a response. Those commands will work just fine on any linux box running iptables, the reason I contacted netgear was to see if its possible to save those rules after a reboot of the router. So far it seems the answer is no, so it may be that you have to put them in after any router reboot.
Also, counters do zero after a reboot, not sure how to stop that happening as I never really used this. You could put the commands (you only really need 3 or 4 lines) in a text file/script and just run them if you reboot your router. If you are like me thats about once a month, tops.

[blackeagle]

Wow squawk thats pretty powerful. I really must spend some effort getting acquainted with linux :o

I don't know if the linksys will save the commands either, but I can build them into the CLI in DMT so they will be executed automatically. I hardly ever reboot it, only really if it locks up.

Right, back to business :)

This is the beginning of the chains

iptables -vnL
Chain INPUT (policy DROP 1146 packets, 257K bytes)
pkts bytes target prot opt in out source destination
0 0 DROP tcp -- !ppp0 * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0 state NEW tcp flags:!0x16/0x02
45521 12M ACCEPT all -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0 state RELATED,ESTABLISHED
11126 2284K REAIM_IN all -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0
1148 257K LOG all -- ppp0 * 0.0.0.0/0 xx.xx.xx.xx state NEW LOG flags 0 level 4 prefix `[Incoming]'
422 194K INPUT_UDP udp -- ppp0 * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0
681 60176 INPUT_TCP tcp -- ppp0 * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0
45 2685 DOS icmp -- ppp0 * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0 icmp type 8
9975 2026K ACCEPT all -- !ppp0 * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0 state NEW

Chain FORWARD (policy DROP 5 packets, 307 bytes)
pkts bytes target prot opt in out source destination
3806 220K LOG all -- br0 ppp0 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0 state NEW LOG flags 0 level 4 prefix `[Outgoing]'
0 0 LOG all -- ppp0 br0 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0 state NEW LOG flags 0 level 4 prefix `[Incoming]'
2 120 POLICY icmp -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0
1517 125K POLICY udp -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0
258K 205M POLICY tcp -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0
2418 126K TCPMSS tcp -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0 tcp flags:0x06/0x02 TCPMSS clamp to PMTU
99577 11M ACCEPT all -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0 state RELATED,ESTABLISHED
3801 220K ACCEPT all -- !ppp0 * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0 state NEW
0 0 ACCEPT all -- br0 br0 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0

Chain OUTPUT (policy ACCEPT 58894 packets, 32M bytes)
pkts bytes target prot opt in out source destination
784 76209 ACCEPT icmp -- * br0 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0
0 0 DROP icmp -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0 state INVALID


There are lots of others too, but i'm guessing they are all called from one of these three chains (like a subroutine).

So, if I insert the bandwidth chain in the same places as you, is that right ? If so, thats pretty simple to do, just have to reboot router every calendar month, but I can write something to do that (probably!)



nat gives me this


iptables -t nat -vnL
Chain PREROUTING (policy ACCEPT 27973 packets, 2588K bytes)
pkts bytes target prot opt in out source destination
0 0 DROP 52 -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0
9533 891K REAIM_PRE all -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0
0 0 DNS udp -- br0 * 0.0.0.0/0 192.168.1.1 udp dpt:53
0 0 DNAT tcp -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 xx.xx.xx.xx tcp dpt:992 to:192.168.1.100:992
0 0 DNAT udp -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 xx.xx.xx.xx udp dpt:992 to:192.168.1.100:992
0 0 DNAT tcp -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 xx.xx.xx.xx tcp dpt:53992 to:192.168.1.100:53992
0 0 DNAT udp -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 xx.xx.xx.xx udp dpt:53992 to:192.168.1.100:53992
0 0 DNAT tcp -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 xx.xx.xx.xx tcp dpt:41952 to:192.168.1.100:41952
0 0 DNAT udp -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 xx.xx.xx.xx udp dpt:41952 to:192.168.1.100:41952

Chain POSTROUTING (policy ACCEPT 5088 packets, 365K bytes)
pkts bytes target prot opt in out source destination
3716 211K MASQUERADE all -- * ppp0 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0
0 0 SNAT udp -- * * 192.168.1.0/24 192.168.1.100 udp dpt:992 to:xx.xx.xx.xx
0 0 SNAT tcp -- * * 192.168.1.0/24 192.168.1.100 tcp dpt:992 to:xx.xx.xx.xx
0 0 SNAT udp -- * * 192.168.1.0/24 192.168.1.100 udp dpt:53992 to:xx.xx.xx.xx
0 0 SNAT tcp -- * * 192.168.1.0/24 192.168.1.100 tcp dpt:53992 to:xx.xx.xx.xx
0 0 SNAT udp -- * * 192.168.1.0/24 192.168.1.100 udp dpt:41952 to:xx.xx.xx.xx
0 0 SNAT tcp -- * * 192.168.1.0/24 192.168.1.100 tcp dpt:41952 to:xx.xx.xx.xx

Chain OUTPUT (policy ACCEPT 0 packets, 0 bytes)
pkts bytes target prot opt in out source destination

Chain DNS (1 references)
pkts bytes target prot opt in out source destination
0 0 DNAT all -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 192.168.1.1 random 50% to:62.24.218.50
0 0 DNAT all -- * * 0.0.0.0/0 192.168.1.1 to:62.24.218.51

Chain REAIM_PRE (1 references)
pkts bytes target prot opt in out source destination
4 208 REDIRECT tcp -- br0 * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0 tcp dpt:1863 redir ports 1863
0 0 REDIRECT tcp -- br0 * 0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0 tcp dpt:5190 redir ports 5190
#

[Squawk]

Ok obviously I can't see all the chains so its hard to tell exactly what everything is doing.

However, yes it should be very easy.

Now one thing, we want to make sure that you only log traffic thats actually going to and from the WEB, rather than traffic thats going around your LAN and wont be used in the usage stats. So, I would propose the following.

iptables -I INPUT -i ppp0 # record all incoming web traffic to the router
iptables -I OUTPUT -o ppp0 # record all outgoing traffic to the router
iptables -I FORWARD -o ppp0 # Packets from your LAN to the internet
iptables -I FORWARD -i ppp0 # Packets from the internet to your LAN.

That will record (I think), all incoming and outgoing packets, regardless of whether they are blocked by the firewall or whether a connection is actually made. If someone could verify that for me it would be great.

One thing to note, for the outgoing rules, idealy the rule should come after any "drop" statements but before any accept statements, so that you dont record traffic that gets blocked as having actually left your LAN. Hard to tell without seeing what all those chains do though.

[matt]

The bytes in / bytes out counts are available on most routers, on the HG520s they are accessible via the admin console in the menu Basic / Statistics.

They are listed under ATM octets in / octets out. Which is bytes in / bytes out.

In = Download
Out = Upload

Add them together divide by 1024 twice and you have your total GB consumption.

You can reset it each calendar month and as long as you don't turn your router off you can see your total usuage from every device on the network.

Its also available on the MT882 in exactly the same location but is listed, from memory, as TX bytes and RX bytes

TX = Upload
RX = Download

[blackeagle]

The bytes in / bytes out counts are available on most routers

Yeah, sadly not on mine :mad:

I have however with squawks help, got a work around !!

[damianiw]

damian, I havnt had a play with a netgear router either. I actually posted recently on the netgear forums to see what you can do with iptables and didnt get much of a response. Those commands will work just fine on any linux box running iptables, the reason I contacted netgear was to see if its possible to save those rules after a reboot of the router. So far it seems the answer is no, so it may be that you have to put them in after any router reboot.
Also, counters do zero after a reboot, not sure how to stop that happening as I never really used this. You could put the commands (you only really need 3 or 4 lines) in a text file/script and just run them if you reboot your router. If you are like me thats about once a month, tops.

Thanks, I'll have a play with this at the weekend :D

[mattkyleuk]

If not a application itself made available by talktalk, how about the option to view online by logging into our account?
Talktalk obviously keep track of the usage one way or another in order to charge for over usage etc
Is it not as easy as it may seem just to transfer the option to check current usage by requesting from talktalk in anyway?

[mattkyleuk]

Can u request ure usage, because how are u supposed to know how much u go left?!

[matt]

The usage is currently reported in a huge data run each month and its a very manual task.

As stated earlier in this thread they have a usage monitor in the works but they don't have a release date for it.

[grajay]

I found this on a Netgear forum:-
SNMP does work on this router. For some strange reason however, the router adds a firewall rule to disable SNMP traffic as soon as you enable SNMP!

Steps:

1) Access your router on http://192.168.0.1/snmp.htm
2) Enable SNMP and make your community name 'public'. Click Apply.
3) Type in the address bar: http://192.168.0.1/setup.cgi?todo=debug (it will say "Debug enabled").
4) Click Start, Run, type in 'cmd' to get a command prompt.
5) Type 'telnet 192.168.0.1' (You will see a BusyBox shell prompt).
6) type 'iptables -D INPUT 1' at the # prompt (this removes the SNMP blocking firewall rule).

If you changed your router's IP away from 192.168.0.1 then change it to whatever IP your router uses.

And now PRTG and whatever else can access SNMP. Note: in PRTG the WAN traffic is logged as LAN traffic, and the IN/OUT counters are reversed. LAN traffic is not logged.

I've tried it but no luck.

Cheers

John

I've stumbled upon this thread rather late in the day. I went through the above settings and it seems as though my Netgear DG834Gv3 is now logging my internet traffic using Byteometer whilst ignoring my LAN traffic which is precisely what I needed - so a big thank you from me :D.

I also have Newtork Monitor running and I'll compare them after a day of downloading and file shuffling to be certain, but so far it seems to have done the trick.

Thanks again.

[grajay]

4) Click Start, Run, type in 'cmd' to get a command prompt.
5) Type 'telnet 192.168.0.1' (You will see a BusyBox shell prompt).
6) type 'iptables -D INPUT 1' at the # prompt (this removes the SNMP blocking firewall rule).


Having switched off my router last evening - I discovered that in order for the above to work, these steps have to be re-entered each time the router is re-booted.

I'm not clever in this way, but is it possible to write a small batch file (or similar) to run automatically at start up to carry out these steps (maybe place it in the startup folder) please?

Thanks

[Squawk]

Grajay, I actually posted on the netgear forums asking if it was possible to save custom rules on that router, either by writing a little shell script or by running a particular command, and was told "no". However, since you can telnet to the router, it should be possible to write some kind of script to login and run the command when the router is rebooted. However, I wouldn't run that command unless you actually know what it does.
iptables -D INPUT 1 is a powerful command, basically it removes the first rule in your INPUT chain, and I would strongly advise you to understand exactly what rule 1 is before you delete it. And bear in mind that if you run it more than once you will delete the second rule as it will now be the first.

[blackeagle]

Unfortunately it can't easily be done with a DOS batch file, as telnet is an exe and you can't pipe parameters to it :( There are however various addon utilities that will do the job for you).

Google, as ever, is your friend :D

[Squawk]

well I know that if you run the connect and go cd it can telnet and run commands on my router (it restricts access to the services from the internet, took some figuring out that did), so it can be done. the problem is that I don't have the first clue about telnet (ssh ftw)

[blackeagle]

S'pose I could write a program to do it, its only a question of sending the right commands, I was just looking for an easy/lazy way of doing it in DOS, but there isn't one. Maybe it can be done with Windows scripting host. I'll look into it later. I use telnet on my router, so the whole thing might be a useful exercise.

[Squawk]

Ok its definitely possible to do it.
Unfortunately I know sod all about batchfile scripting, so the following is a short linux shell script. However, it should tell you what you need to do. First of all, I define a function that echos my username, password, and the command I want to run, all after a short pause, all of it piped to the telnet command. So, to execute the iptables command that someone was on about earlier, it would be something like

telnetiptables () {

(sleep 3;
echo admin; sleep 3;
echo admin; sleep 5;
echo "iptables -D INPUT 1";
sleep 3;
echo "exit") | telnet 192.168.1.1
}
telnetiptables


If anyone is planning on checking that script, I suggest you change the iptables line to "iptables -nL" to make sure things work as expected.

Please note that I plagerised this from something I found on the internet and just adopted it for my purposes.

[blackeagle]

Yeah, I would do it a similar way in DOS, but telnet won't accept any parameters other than


C:\>telnet /?

telnet [-a][-e escape char][-f log file][-l user][-t term][host [port]]
-a Attempt automatic logon. Same as -l option except uses
the currently logged on user's name.
-e Escape character to enter telnet client prompt.
-f File name for client side logging
-l Specifies the user name to log in with on the remote system.
Requires that the remote system support the TELNET ENVIRON option.
-t Specifies terminal type.
Supported term types are vt100, vt52, ansi and vtnt only.
host Specifies the hostname or IP address of the remote computer
to connect to.
port Specifies a port number or service name.

C:\>

Once telnet is invoked in a script, control passes from the script to the telnet session, thus it requires user input. Once terminated, control passes back to the script, thus it is impossible for the script to interact with a telnet session. This is a limitation of the telnet implementation in windows.

[Squawk]

telnet won't accept paramters in linux either. What you have to do is to pipe the various commands you want to run to the telnet command. The only thing is I have no clue what the equivalent of a linux pipe is in windows.

I am not sure what your linux knowledge is (command line), so excuse the quick summary.

When a command is run on linux command line, you have options. It can output to various places.

So, if I want to list the contents of a directory, I can do

ls -l

and the contents appear on screen, along with basic information about each file

If I want the output to go to a file instead of to screen, I use the redirect command >

ls -l > filename.txt

which redirects the output to a textfile named filename.txt.

A third option is to use pipe, which takes the output of one command and pipes it into the next. For example, if I wanted to see how many files were in the directory, I would use ls -l to list the files, and pipe that output to wc -l to count how many lines, ie

ls -l | wc -l

With telnet, although it seems that you can't give telnet options, you can pipe output to it that will be interpreted by the new telnet shell. In linux thats achived with the pipe command |, I have no clue what the windows equiv is, but hopefully that explanation of the linux version will help you figure it out.

[blackeagle]

DOS redirects and pipes are very similar < | >

ipconfig | find /i "default gateway" | findstr [0-9] > c:\tmp.dat

Is a line from my nettest batch file, which uses pipes and redirects. The output of the ipconfig command is piped as input to the find command the output of which is piped to findstr, the output of that is piped to a file.

Tried it all ways up with telnet. Can't get it to do it so far !!

[Squawk]

Bah, now look what you made me do, im gonna jump on the winblows pc and see if I can figure it out. and I know NOTHING about dos.

[Squawk]

Meh, far too complicated, don't know any of those commands. However, bit of gooling reveals it should be easy if you understand windows syntax. Just google "telnet batchfile", and read up ;)

[blackeagle]

Have already read up !!

Believe me, native windows telnet client is not redirectable, otherwise a script would be a doddle. You either need a replacement telnet client, or do it in perl or something.

use Net::Telnet;
$telnet = new Net::Telnet ( Timeout=>10, Errmode=>'die' Prompt => '/\$ $/i'); $telnet->open('192.168.1.1');
$telnet->login('admin', 'admin');
print $telnet->cmd('iptables -nL');

[ETEE]

AFAIK piping DOS commands in batch files is one thing, but as has been said adding executables into the command line is another matter altogether. Also DOS is not that reliable as some commands will not accept parameters and some will not send returns. In DOS if you are doing this sort of thing you need to increase the memory DOS sets aside for storing programs and strings which is 127 bytes by default.

I think it's something like this:-

SET ENVIRON = 512

Can't check as my DOS machine is resting.

I have some excellent BATCH program files.

[Squawk]

Ok, then I suggest you all install cygwin and run linux commands that way ;). Or else get matt or chris (you guys are lazy, admit it, you don't have anything else to do) to find out how the connect and go cd logs in via telnet and updates things. I know for a fact it does.

[ETEE]

I tried modifying my MT882 as per Kitz's instructions to convert it into a Solwise router using Telnet but only managed to break it! So I need Telnet lessons as well even if I only get to dump the entire MT882 memory.

[Squawk]

I wouldn't worry too much about messing things up. Recently I was trying to figure out which dns servers my router is using, and since I couldnt figure it out going through the route web pages I tried telnet. Well, 50 attempts later and still no joy, and then I managed to type a command that reset my router to factory defaults :confused::confused::eek::(:mad:

I think it was "sys defaults", which makes sense, but I thought it might display the default settings like dns servers and gateways....

Still havnt figure out which dns servers im using with the echolife, if anyone knows, tell me pls

[blackeagle]

Now thats easy in DOS, cos nslookup tells you the dns server its using ;)


C:\>nslookup www.talktalk.net
Server: resolver1.opendns.com
Address: 208.67.222.222:53

Non-authoritative answer:
Name: www.talktalk.net.WAG54GS
Address: 208.69.32.130


C:\>

[Squawk]

Well of course, plenty of ways to tell which dns server my desktop is using. Unfortunately its using the router, so nslookup shows 192.168.1.1 as the dns server. As does any other command I care to run to determine the dns server (and there are many ways, most simple of which is cat /etc/resolv.conf, since I set it myself ;)

[grajay]

Wow - you guys :eek: Looks like I sparked something off here.

[sheilaville]

Keeping track of my usage with DU Meter ,anybody know the start and cut off dates for resetting your 40gb allowamce , is it calender month or anniversary of go live date ?

[Dustybug]

Keeping track of my usage with DU Meter ,anybody know the start and cut off dates for resetting your 40gb allowamce , is it calender month or anniversary of go live date ?

It's the first of every month.

[Recoil]

Yes, a usage meter would be nice. All this stuff looks more complex than it could be.

It would be nice if TalkTalk put a meter on the "My Account" page (as someone said before) at www.talktalk.co.uk.

You could have the upload usage, the download usage and the total (up and down) usage. Just my thought.

It would keep things as simple as possible, rather than using third-party programs or hacking routers etc to view it.

Although it doesnt really bother me too much, as i know that i wont hit the 40GB a month.

[jpd1977uk]

I also agree.. An online usage meter in the "my account" area would be useful.
:)

Do TT send email/sms/letter if you approach the 40Gb cap?.
:confused:

[Shelby]

Greetings I know that this has been mentioned before. I came across this site and downloaded the lite version, Everything is more or less self explanetary and for simple people like me who don't want to get bogged down with all techie stuff. It has a little log that changes every couple of minutes and tells you directly how much you have downloaded and uploaded.Its vista compatible and best of all its free.

Have Fun
Here is the link

http://www.rokario.com/products/bandmon/2-0/

[munster]

:D Hello, everybody, I've had a good read of this section, and I have found a free bit of software which does whats required. I'm not at all versed at linux, but using this piece of software has given me all the information I need to know how much bandwidth my household uses (1 lappy, 1 desktop and Xboxlive )We all go through a Netgear DG834g. I enabled telnet services in Vista premium and the enabled snmp, using the links posted here :).
Heres the link for the software:

CLICK HERE (http://www.vwlowen.co.uk/internet/files.htm)

It gives you all the information that any "normal" user needs :)

Here is a snippet of usage:

# ifconfig
br0 Link encap:Ethernet HWaddr xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
inet addr:192.168.0.1 Bcast:192.168.0.255 Mask:255.255.255.0
UP BROADCAST RUNNING MULTICAST MTU:1500 Metric:1
RX packets:856987 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 frame:0
TX packets:1462375 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
collisions:0 txqueuelen:0
RX bytes:72064189 (68.7 Mb) TX bytes:1813830023 (1729.8 Mb)

eth0 Link encap:Ethernet HWaddr xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
UP BROADCAST RUNNING MULTICAST MTU:1500 Metric:1
RX packets:2681 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 frame:0
TX packets:8199 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
collisions:0 txqueuelen:100
RX bytes:575687 (562.1 kb) TX bytes:3744395 (3.5 Mb)

lo Link encap:Local Loopback
inet addr:127.0.0.1 Mask:255.0.0.0
UP LOOPBACK RUNNING MTU:16436 Metric:1
RX packets:7563 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 frame:0
TX packets:7563 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
collisions:0 txqueuelen:0
RX bytes:2482908 (2.3 Mb) TX bytes:2482908 (2.3 Mb)

ppp0 Link encap:Point-Point Protocol
inet addr:xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx P-t-P:xxxxxxxxxxxxx Mask:255.255.255.255
UP POINTOPOINT RUNNING NOARP MULTICAST MTU:1432 Metric:1
RX packets:616290 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 frame:0
TX packets:350408 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
collisions:0 txqueuelen:100
RX bytes:769949794 (734.2 Mb) TX bytes:18060934 (17.2 Mb)

This is self explanatory. I harvest the results and feed them into a spreadsheet on a daily basis. Its as good as I'm going to get.....but it gives me piece of mind as I have now started to watch alot of sport, stream radio etc. Bring on REAL UNLIMITED BROADBAND....;P

PS. I help it helps those less versed at telnet and linux. I used putty to telnet into my router, before using this piece of software.

[Squawk]

For anyone intrigued about the above command,
ifconfig is a little bit like ipconfig under windows, but in my opinion a lot better with many more options

Although the output looks complicated its fairly simple. For anyone with the netgear who might try this let me talk you through some of the bits that he just posted above

Notice the output pasted is split into 4 sesctions. At the top of the 4 sections we have the following

Section 1: br0 - This is the wireless interface of the router
Section 2: eth0 - Ethernet, communication over the wired LAN
Section 3: lo - The local interface, the router talking to itself
Section 4: ppp0 - The internet connection

Of interest for bandwidth monitoring is ppp0.

So, lets look at the interesting line in that section for bandwidth monitoring

RX bytes:769949794 (734.2 Mb) TX bytes:18060934 (17.2 Mb)

This tells us that the connection has receieved 734.2Mb since its last reboot and has transmitted 17.2Mb

To figure out your bandwidth consumption you could either do as munster suggests and log that data daily, or to get a rough idea just see what your router uptime is (leave it on for a few days of use) and then do the simply maths to work out your average daily, and then average montly usage.

[Steve]

It's a pity it doesn't work on the Echolife router.

[Squawk]

Steve, that pretty much sums up most of my feelings about the echolife. I now pretty much love the thing (as a router you understand...) but I don't have access to the various linux commands that must be embedded in it because apparently it is running a flavour of linux.

There are however a **** of a lot of things you can do by telneting into the echolife, you just need to play about with it.

[Steve]

The things you say are way over my head so I am not even going to attempt anything to do with the router.

[munster]

Hello SQUAWK again, out of interest, I am using the br0 totals for my as this reflects roughly what my lappy is using (Lappy monitored by Netmeter software) Do I NEED to add the ppp0 taffic to this as well or is it included in the ? An answer would be much appeciated....ty again

[Squawk]

hehe. As you noticed Munster, I am collecting.

If you use just br0 then all you will track all traffic that goes to and from the wireless part of the router. It won't care what that is communicating with, could be one laptop of 50 laptops.

One thing to note, lets say you have two laptops on the network at home sharing files over wireless, if you transfer say 1000mp3's between them the traffic over br0 might go up by 5Gb but you wouldn't actually have used any of your talktalk allowance.

If you want to track your internet usage then you can forget all the rest and look purely at ppp0. It will look at traffic that comes from and goes to the internet and again won't care which of your computers that traffic goes to.

[munster]

Thanks again Squack, I'll just remember to take readings of both br0 and ppp0 stats before I transfer files across across my network. :D

[Squawk]

Heh, fraid for inclusion I have to believe speeling(...) mistakes are genuine, and since it got pointed out, that one don't count.

And no problems

[munster]

lol Soz for the typos Squawk!

[theronkinator]

I think we really need a bandwidth usage monitor. It's rediculous to expect that we can stick to a 40gig limit without knowing how much we have downloaded. Software is useless, how do I keep track of two desktops, one laptop, one Nintendo Wii, and one modded xbox that is regually used to watch apple movie trailers(fairly big files). Also gaming, 4od, bbc iplayer all use up a fair bit of bandwidth and we can't accurately know how much we have left.

[Stixman99]

Hi

Been with Talk Talk just under and month and with a couple of small glitches everything seems good.

The main thing I see as being missing is a usage meter as I have two teenage sons who enjoy on line games.

I searched high and low but cannot find any software that would do this.

So come on Talk Talk it would allow me to stop nagging them if its OK or unplug them if not.

Cheers

JOhn

Hi

Try Down2Home I have it set up on my PC you can set up the 40Gb limit per month and it tells you in percentage how much you have left. One draw back is that if you have more than one PC then you will need to install it on all of them and add the downloads up manually

Try this link below

http://jitserv.coolfreepage.com/

Careful it opens another webpage Coolwebpage !!! just close this down

Stixman99

[Janitor]

I to would like a Download meter on the home page,as all my computers are macs most of the software meters are useless, can't even find a software meter for osx.

[Prism]

For anyone needing one for PC then check out Stephens post #16 I've had this one for a while now and it does a good job, uses little to no system resources and zero spam from the company :D

[Chris]

Alternative free ones that have been mentioned and used on these forums include:

Netlimiter (http://www.netlimiter.com/)
BitMeter (http://http://codebox.no-ip.net/controller?page=bitmeter2)
NetMeter (http://www.metal-machine.de/readerror/)

[FreeThinker]

Being trying this one on a 30 day trial, £11 to register.seems very comprehensive monitor total traffic on a daily,weekly and monthly basis real time speed reporting and loads more.Might be worth a look;)
http://www.bandwidth-meter.net/

[halifax50]

Being trying this one on a 30 day trial, £11 to register.seems very comprehensive monitor total traffic on a daily,weekly and monthly basis real time speed reporting and loads more.Might be worth a look;)
http://www.bandwidth-meter.net/

I have purchased this and find the Traffic reports really helpful. No idea how to use the real time speed reporting any help would be appreciated.:s

[FreeThinker]

I have purchased this and find the Traffic reports really helpful. No idea how to use the real time speed reporting any help would be appreciated.:s

If you are just running it minimised on the taskbar then you will not see it.double click on it during a download and you will get a graph popping up with 3 coloured graphs on it
Red download speed
green upload speed
yellow down+up
along the bottom you will see the max speed ,average down (Red)and average up (green) not sure the period the average is calculated over think 30 secs is the default

[Bruce]

I have more than 1 PC connected, so it's not easy to know what the total bandwidth usage is.

If they can smack you for using too much, then they must have the usage figures logged.

[FreeThinker]

I have more than 1 PC connected, so it's not easy to know what the total bandwidth usage is.

If they can smack you for using too much, then they must have the usage figures logged.

They most likley compile these figures at the end of each month and are not availible on an ad hoc basis.Going over your limit would most likley result in a warning email in the first instance with a closer eye kept on your useage (perhaps weekly)after that.Just a guess from what i've picked up from other threads.New month starts on the 1st apparently :).The monitor mentioned above has an 'All Connections'option which I assume monitors all throughput of your router (ie all traffic).This would most likey be all LAN traffic as well as internet traffic but in a home environment should give a good indication.Cannot be more specific as i've only used it for a couple of days and only have one computer connected so I could be completely wrong,but you can try it for 30 days before buying.

[trinity]

Being trying this one on a 30 day trial, £11 to register.seems very comprehensive monitor total traffic on a daily,weekly and monthly basis real time speed reporting and loads more.Might be worth a look;)
http://www.bandwidth-meter.net/

This one (http://www.softperfect.com/products/networx/)looks interesting. Also available on 30 day trial, and about £12 thereafter. Going to give it a try, but have to wait until Tuesday before I get the chance to download it.

[Bruce]

What we need is something that combines what RouterStats and Bandwidth-Meter both do. I want a daily/weekly/monthly log of what my router traffic is.

I'd be happy with just a monthly usage log, showing what my usage was for previous months. Assuming TT log those at the end of the month, then they could make then available to the user. OK, that doesn't help those who expect to run out of bandwidth early, but at least it gives you an idea of your usual usage. Right now I have no idea if my usage is 10, 20, or close to 40GB per month. I've just moved from having a 50GB allowance, and only twice went over it.

[FreeThinker]

What we need is something that combines what RouterStats and Bandwidth-Meter both do. I want a daily/weekly/monthly log of what my router traffic is.

I'd be happy with just a monthly usage log, showing what my usage was for previous months. Assuming TT log those at the end of the month, then they could make then available to the user. OK, that doesn't help those who expect to run out of bandwidth early, but at least it gives you an idea of your usual usage. Right now I have no idea if my usage is 10, 20, or close to 40GB per month. I've just moved from having a 50GB allowance, and only twice went over it.
I suspect TT would not release these figures, they have been very reluctant to release a monitor and I suspect for the same reason... they do not want you to know how much you are using.
From memory the vast majority of people are using around 2-3 gig a month with a good percentage useing far less, If these people were told 'Hey you still have 30+ gigs left for the month' it could cause havoc to TT's network.:eek:

[Squawk]

It's not exactly a secret, in recently published articles talktalk say that 50% of customers use less than 2gb a month. The article was linked to around here somewhere, no idea where. It was referenced at the register.co.uk where you could go and take a peak.

[FreeThinker]

It's not exactly a secret, in recently published articles talktalk say that 50% of customers use less than 2gb a month. The article was linked to around here somewhere, no idea where. It was referenced at the register.co.uk where you could go and take a peak.

I never seid it was a secret just not common knowledge :D.I would lay good money that if they all knew there useage it would rise noticeably.Not suggesting TT are doing anthing wrong just that it's human nature that people would feel more inclined to use more of thier allowance if they were told how much they had used/had left.Or do you disagree?:s

[bazildog]

I like netlimiter 2, can be simple view on usage or show a per exe break down www.netlimiter.com

[theronkinator]

I think I might contact ofcom about this and see what they say, I'm pretty sure it must break some rules.
*edited* Stupid Analogy.

[OCE_Stephen]

Hello theronkinator,

What is your concern? If you reach your limit you will be sent a letter advising you of that fact. We have a 3 strikes and your out policy.

If after your first letter your usage doesn't reduce then you will be sent a 2nd and a 3rd, don't worry you will get plenty of warning before we take any action.

Also I am a virgin Media customer and they are unable to tell me how much I have used either.....

Hope this makes sense....

[Squawk]

I would suggest ofcom is probably a bit extreme, but I do think he makes a valid point, if with a shocking example. I am actually struggling to come up with a reasonable analogy in that there is a three strikes and you are out rule rather than a straight cut off. Straight cut off would be like driving a car with no fuel gauge. The only other example along the same lines I can think of is my webshost, which offers me "unlimited" bandwidth, but has declined to tell me what "unlimited" actually is. I suspect I could find out if I emailed them.

[OCE_Stephen]

Virgin told me they have a fair usage policy which is only put in play if you go over 100Gb but they couldn't tell me what i was using apparently they have a similar process to us, "3 and you are out"

[BuffsMad]

The difficulty is in most things where limits apply there is the ability to measure it: speedlimits, length of a phone call etc. But these are built into the equipment not provided by those who impose the limit. Its not the responsibility of those that set the limit to warn you when you are approaching it. The speed cameras just flash you! However, without the tools to do it yourself then........the point is made. How can it be done. If a router is what 'provides' the throughput then it is on the router that a measurement system should be located. Even the tools that we can use to measure it aren't reliable because they only measure it for the equipment they are attached to and most don't save a log.

The only thing that will do anything for this is either an entrpreneuer (spelling) or wizzkid seeing an opportunity OR a court case - Joe Public v's Mr ISP OR a existing router manufacturer that sees an opportunity to gain market share as a prefered supplier to ISPs.

OFCOM is extreme in terms of complaint against an ISP for not releasing figures but it is the one body that could require routers to contain monitors.

[Squawk]

Buffsmad, the problem with that theory is that you miss one vital point, the ISP knows how much traffic you are using already. If they did not then it would be impossible to say you are a heavy user and to impose the limit.

The problem that exists is a mechanism for getting that information to the customer, not the availability of the information itself. Talktalk could subject each and every packet running from your connection to DPI if they so desired.

Must admit that without knowing exactly how its implemented I can't imagine why a usage summary is so hard to produce, but the guys answering that question around here are very technically competent so if they say it currently can't be done then it can't be done.

[OCE_Stephen]

Before LLU we had the ability to give you the download usage in real time.....

With the new systems for LLU we have not been able to combine all the systems together to get a live reporting system for all to use.

It is on the list of things to do and we will get one "people are working on it" but to be honest there are things with a higher priority on the list.....

[BuffsMad]

Of course Squawk, accepted. The fact that they are in a position to tell you before you overuse does make it different. Example - there are traffic signs that tell you your speed limit but they are never before a speed camera. (No scratch that - thats for revenue reasons so not exactly relevent.lol)

There are all sorts of reasons why they can't and/or won't. However, it is not their responsibility to - that's what I was trying to say. If it comes it will probably come from the router maufacturers. So much for Net Limiter 2, it fell over on my machine, bumped its head and the useage data is gone.

[trs55]

Ratty, google for something like "snmp router monitor", and find software like this (http://www.byteometer.com/snmp-router-monitor.asp)
SNMP is a protocol that allows monitoring of various aspects of your router, in particular the ammount of traffic coming and going at any given time, total downloads over periods of time, that kind of thing. I have no experience with that piece of software I linked to, but it should give you an idea of what is available. Only need to install it on one pc too.

I have got Netmeter on both of my PC's but when I transfer data between the two pc's on LAN, Netmeter adds that as well so I have to remember to turn it off on both machines each time I do a transfer which is a pain as they are on different floors so would a snmp monitor just record traffic on WAN only?.

[BuffsMad]

There's another......onlineeye....that records WAN traffic. (But I had probs with it on Vista,):|

[damianiw]

I can't believe this still hasn't been setup for users, it's not fair to say you have a usage limit, we'll review how much you use but won't tell you unless you go over!

How about even just putting the summary info you use on our monthly bills ???

Oh well I guess it will be an interesting argument between anyone given a strike and offcom as they had no way of knowing how close they were to their limit.

[kondor101]

Hang on, maybe this would work better if we asked for something "a bit better than what we have".

At the moment, from what I am reading, we only get told if our usage has gone over the 40GB limit last month.

Would it be possible to have a system where we could find out what our last months usage was no matter if we went over it or not?

I am putting this forward as a suggestion as it would enable us to see if we needed to tighten up or investigate our own home networks if we noticed usage was a bit higher than we expected.

If this is not quite possible, a shorter step might be to have a page would give the information...
Green - "You used less than 30gb last month"
Amber - "You used more than 30gb last month, we suggest getting a usage meter"
and
Red - "You used more than 40gb last month, you must reduce your usage"

Just some ideas, 40GB is a fair amount, I think I have only ever gone over 40GB once in my life (different ISP) and I had to try really hard.

[zeus]

Hi All

Can I just refer to recent post #106 on this thread .. TT are obviously aware of this requirement but need to give it a realistic priority level for the moment .. undoubtably we will eventually get a solution, whether it be traffic light, on the bill or even a full bandwidth traffic analysis.

Can I suggest someone from TT reaffirms that this is the position by posting to this thread .. and when this is done .. that someone starts a BB metering 'wish list' thread so that the guys at TT can see what flavour of metering would be more popular and be able to spec the requirements accordingly. This thread can then be closed off.

This might not expediate the delivery of metering but would be more positive and constructive approach.

Your thoughts ...

[kondor101]

Well said zeus and thanks for highlighting post 106.

There is little need for a wish list, as basically all everyone actually wishes for is live updating. Referring back to post 106 it is obvious that the problem is getting all the bits working together on LLU. Hence the suggestion of using some sort of "this is what you used last month" system for the time being, even if it is just a traffic light system to put peoples minds at rest.

As said, 40GB is a lot, and you do get a few warnings too so it is not a major issue but it is something that is lacking. In days of increased VoD and speeds this issue will grow. With that in mind I am sure you agree it is only common sense to deal with this problem before it does become a major issue.

[theronkinator]

Please can we have the monitor soon? How can we be expected to stay under a limit with no way of knowing how close we are to it.

[OCE_Stephen]

Hello,

We are working on such a tool and we will let you know when we have more info around timescales.

Thanks